Gold Ring in the Woods - Need Help with Hallmark

[Mr. Digger]

A find worthy of the Eye Popping and Mind Blowing section for sure!!!!!!

 

[troynh]

An amazing, incredible piece of history you found!!!

Curious, what is a mid 30s TID on a Deus, with respect to a nickel?

I am living in Oklahoma now, but grew up in PA, and I know where there's a cellar hole that looks almost EXACTLY like the one in your picture; in fact, your picture made me do a double-take! I have it on my list of places to hunt, but haven't done so, yet. I just might do it around Thanksgiving, now, thanks to your post, when we travel back home for the Holiday.

Thanks for the info about how you usually don't find the stuff right adjacent to the cellar hole, but out farther away. I will keep that in mind as I hunt the site.

Meanwhile, CONGRATULATIONS!!!

Steve

The program I'm using on the Deus sounds and acts very similar to the ATPro (Only better...) with regards to tone and VDI. Nickels ring in the low 50's. U.S. silver will ring in the mid 80's and moves up with coin, etc...

Good luck with your spot in PA. Dig everything!

-Tim

 

[steveg]

The program I'm using on the Deus sounds and acts very similar to the ATPro (Only better...) with regards to tone and VDI. Nickels ring in the low 50's. U.S. silver will ring in the mid 80's and moves up with coin, etc...

Good luck with your spot in PA. Dig everything!

-Tim

Tim --

Appreciate that additional info. So, just for my curiosity, you say this hit mid 30s, while a nickel would be low 50s on the program you are running on your Deus. What would a mid-30s be, that I'd be familiar with. Is it lower than a beaver tail, for instance (which comes in just a little below a nickel on my Explorer)? Sounds like it would be quite a bit lower than a beaver tail, unless there is TREMENDOUS resolution in those lower VDI numbers on the Deus. Mid 30s for that ring, and low 50s for a nickel, would sound like we are talking WAY down into the foil range, like lower than a .22 bullet, or .22 casing, and down into the "small piece of foil" range? I could see how it could register below a nickel, but even below a .22 round?

WOW. If so, then I understand even better your "dig everything" comment. Like EVERYTHING everything...


I'm guessing (as I am sure you already know) you have a very high-carat ring there...22-24. A BEAUTY!

Steve

 

[Toasted]

Tim --

Appreciate that additional info. So, just for my curiosity, you say this hit mid 30s, while a nickel would be low 50s on the program you are running on your Deus. What would a mid-30s be, that I'd be familiar with. Is it lower than a beaver tail, for instance (which comes in just a little below a nickel on my Explorer)? Sounds like it would be quite a bit lower than a beaver tail, unless there is TREMENDOUS resolution in those lower VDI numbers on the Deus. Mid 30s for that ring, and low 50s for a nickel, would sound like we are talking WAY down into the foil range, like lower than a .22 bullet, or .22 casing, and down into the "small piece of foil" range? I could see how it could register below a nickel, but even below a .22 round?

WOW. If so, then I understand even better your "dig everything" comment. Like EVERYTHING everything...


I'm guessing (as I am sure you already know) you have a very high-carat ring there...22-24. A BEAUTY!

Steve

Youve got to dig those foil like numbers if you want to find tombac buttons. Probably thought he was digging another until that awesome ring popped out

 

[Hillside Angler]

That's sooo nice. Kinda stunned right now.

 

[steveg]

Youve got to dig those foil like numbers if you want to find tombac buttons. Probably thought he was digging another until that awesome ring popped out

OK, Toasted, while I grew up in PA, I have been in Oklahoma for the last 20 years, and -- aside from a few hours with a machine I found in my grandfather's basement as a kid -- I have gained the majority of detecting experience here in Oklahoma, and thus largely on sites "younger" than about 1890.

SO -- as I am hunting these much older sites when I visit my home back in PA, I realize I need to "dig different/lower tones" on some of these old sites than I do, here. And I do -- but that doesn't mean I know what to expect to find, and I probably wouldn't have dug all the way down into the foil range.

So, with that background, can you answer an ignorant question for me -- what is a "tombac button?"

Steve

 

[BottleCapKing]

Wow. That is a stunning piece of history you found there. A find of a lifetime for sure.

 

[Toasted]

OK, Toasted, while I grew up in PA, I have been in Oklahoma for the last 20 years, and -- aside from a few hours with a machine I found in my grandfather's basement as a kid -- I have gained the majority of detecting experience here in Oklahoma, and thus largely on sites "younger" than about 1890.

SO -- as I am hunting these much older sites when I visit my home back in PA, I realize I need to "dig different/lower tones" on some of these old sites than I do, here. And I do -- but that doesn't mean I know what to expect to find, and I probably wouldn't have dug all the way down into the foil range.

So, with that background, can you answer an ignorant question for me -- what is a "tombac button?"

Steve

Tombacs were the most common button in use in 18th century

 

[troynh]

Tim --

Appreciate that additional info. So, just for my curiosity, you say this hit mid 30s, while a nickel would be low 50s on the program you are running on your Deus. What would a mid-30s be, that I'd be familiar with. Is it lower than a beaver tail, for instance (which comes in just a little below a nickel on my Explorer)? Sounds like it would be quite a bit lower than a beaver tail, unless there is TREMENDOUS resolution in those lower VDI numbers on the Deus. Mid 30s for that ring, and low 50s for a nickel, would sound like we are talking WAY down into the foil range, like lower than a .22 bullet, or .22 casing, and down into the "small piece of foil" range? I could see how it could register below a nickel, but even below a .22 round?

WOW. If so, then I understand even better your "dig everything" comment. Like EVERYTHING everything...


I'm guessing (as I am sure you already know) you have a very high-carat ring there...22-24. A BEAUTY!

Steve

Just ran the ring over the coil and it's a solid 38 VDI laying flat.

That said, I also just ran a modern pull tab under the coil and that rings in at a solid 48. Conclusion, DIG EVERYTHING!

BTW Toasted, yes I thought it was going to be a button or a piece of tin...

-Tim

 

[steveg]

Tombacs were the most common button in use in 18th century

Thanks, toasted. So, one more "question of ignorance..." is a "tombac" button the same as a "flat button?"

Just ran the ring over the coil and it's a solid 38 VDI laying flat.

That said, I also just ran a modern pull tab under the coil and that rings in at a solid 48. Conclusion, DIG EVERYTHING!

BTW Toasted, yes I thought it was going to be a button or a piece of tin...

-Tim

Thanks, Tim. Any chance you could run a "beaver tail?" On my Explorer, a "stay tab" from a modern coke can (other, older ones are different) air tests with a FE/CO TID around 09-07. A nickel is like 09-06. A beaver tail is like 10-05 or 10-04. I almost NEVER dig anything lower than a CO number of 04...except maybe at a certain, very specific type of very old site. In other words, I rarely dig below "beaver tail" signals. A .22 round, .22 casing, a percussion cap, all of them are around that "04" conductive ID. I wonder if, on your machine, a beaver tail is lower or higher than that "38" ring...

 

[Toasted]

Thanks, toasted. So, one more "question of ignorance..." is a "tombac" button the same as a "flat button?"

A tombac is a flat button but its alloy gives it the shiny gray appearance and its lower VDI number. There were also copper flat buttons and pewter flat buttons in use at the time as well. The copper buttons usually ring in the zinc range but the pewter ones will usually ring as low as tombac. The copper and pewter buttons generally come out in poorer condition thus the tombac buttons are the most sought after as display pieces as least for me anyway

 

[steveg]

A tombac is a flat button but its alloy gives it the shiny gray appearance and its lower VDI number. There were also copper flat buttons and pewter flat buttons in use at the time as well. The copper buttons usually ring in the zinc range but the pewter ones will usually ring as low as tombac. The copper and pewter buttons generally come out in poorer condition thus the tombac buttons are the most sought after as display pieces as least for me anyway

Ahh. Gotcha, Toasted. Thanks for the mini-education on flat buttons (of which, I now know, tombacs are a subset...)

Thanks!

Steve

 

[troynh]

Unfortunately, I don't have a beaver tail style on hand. I throw those away when found. My assumption is that they would be higher than 38 on my machine.

-Tim

 

[steveg]

Unfortunately, I don't have a beaver tail style on hand. I throw those away when found. My assumption is that they would be higher than 38 on my machine.

-Tim

Gotcha, Tim. If you happen to dig one at some point, and don't mind sending me a PM on what it ID'd at, numerically, on your Deus, I'd really appreciate it.

If the ring is attached to the beaver tail, yes, it will read quite a bit higher. But just the beaver tail itself, broken off of the ring tab, is what I'm talking about. That reads about 10-04 to 10-05 on an Explorer, as I said, and that's about where I'd have assumed that a rather thin-banded gold ring would read, but I'd love to have that confirmed...

Meanwhile, again, CONGRATS on an INCREDIBLE find!

Steve

 

[Cpt_Blood]

Amazing piece of history; Revolutionary or Pre-Rev finds would seem to me to be very rare. Thanks for the pics and follow up.

Congratulations!

 

[troynh]

****Update****

Okay, apparently there are only around 24 pieces identified from John Ball's work and the only known gold ring is at Yale Universtiy which has an extremely similar inscription as mine.

The plot thickens... BTW, This book is an incredible resource!

-Tim

 

[Moe Money]

Okay, I'm dying to find out what kind of an appraisal might be placed on such an early and known makers ring. Regardless it's one of the coolest finds that I've ever seen. Keep us updated if and when you learn more about it.

 

[steveg]

Holy cow, the plot thickens, INDEED....

This is amazing. I'll stay tuned for "the rest of the story," as it unfolds!!!

CONGRATULATIONS on an INCREDIBLE find!

Steve

 

[calabash digger]

WOW!!! That is a rare find you got there my friend. My hunting partner got one this year on a plantation site, it had remember the giver inscribed in it. You nailed it with that ring ,congrats.

 

[troynh]

Just found one of John Ball's ads where he's trying to sell his property in 1766. This was in the Boston Gazette...

-Tim