People complaining about my digger

[GKL]

Maybe someone (or some MD club) in that town made a campaign contribution or otherwise lobbied their elected representative to allow MD shovels. Short of the low level bureaucrat in the parks department, most politicians likely don't care one way or the other.

Hey, however it happened, if I was a detectorist in Baltimore you can be sure I'd be carrying around a copy of that document while detecting

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Maybe someone (or some MD club) in that town made a campaign contribution or otherwise lobbied their elected representative to allow MD shovels. ....

Perhaps. But probably not to distinguish shovel lengths. If there were ever a "lobbying campaign to allow detecting" (type-digger-aside for the moment), then this merely means there was some sort of forbiddance IN THE FIRST PLACE ! And if so, then you have to ask yourself: "Ok, then how did THAT start ?" And I have a sneaking suspicion.

... most politicians likely don't care one way or the other. ....

Until it's put on their desk as a "pressing issue" to need to address.

 

[GKL]

Perhaps. But probably not to distinguish shovel lengths. If there were ever a "lobbying campaign to allow detecting" (type-digger-aside for the moment), then this merely means there was some sort of forbiddance IN THE FIRST PLACE ! And if so, then you have to ask yourself: "Ok, then how did THAT start ?" And I have a sneaking suspicion.

Until it's put on their desk as a "pressing issue" to need to address.

It is interesting that they distinguished between shovels in general and shovels designed specifically for metal detecting.

Maybe there was someone on the committee that was either knowledgeable about the hobby or researched it and found out that a shovel designed for metal detecting left the area looking much better than what regular shovels would.

But I can appreciate your preference that ideally permits should not be required and if something is not expressly prohibited then it should be allowed. ......but I look at it this way, if a town does require a permit I'd use it to my advantage and carry a copy with me while detecting/digging to educate those who are unaware you are doing nothing wrong if they question you.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

It is interesting that they distinguished between shovels in general and shovels designed specifically for metal detecting....

Hey GKL, haven't you seen all the silly rules and distinctions and definitions that come with permits, when dreamed up at various places ? Eg.: the "fine print" ? Things like : "Not within 10 ft. of any tree", or "digger tool shall not exceed 3 inches in length", or "turn in all items to lost & found" (yeah right), or "on sandy beaches only", blah blah blah. And ... seriously now.... do you think that ANYONE is interested in distinguishing, or even thinking about such sillyness ? The question is really: WHY is someone commenting on shovel lengths, trees, earthworms, lost & found, blah blah.

I too find it "interesting". Ie.: why do they care in the first place, to the extent that it's even spelled out on a city-list-of-rules. And I know the reason why.

...
Maybe there was someone on the committee that was either knowledgeable about the hobby or researched it and found out that a shovel designed for metal detecting left the area looking much better than what regular shovels would.....

Even if this bizarre series of events were true, then still: What put it on that "committee's plate" and radar as something that needed addressing IN THE FIRST PLACE ?

.... to educate those who are unaware you are doing nothing wrong if they question you.

I'd venture to guess that there are plenty of md'rs who either 1) got permission (as if it were needed), or 2) had a "permit", in a city that ever dreamed those up. And still got the stink-eye and scram. EVEN if they can "flash their permission" or "flash their permit". Because all that the griper has to do is get on his cell-phone, call down to city hall and say "But he's tearing the place up !" (which isn't true, of course). So "permits" are not some sort of carte-blanche.

And have you noticed that many cities that used to have these "lovely permits that we all feel so good about", will ..... years later .... simply revoke them altogether ? There's been cases of this. And if you wonder "why ?", here's why: Because the MERE FACT that this is on a list of permits, that they issue, means it's PERPETUALLY ALWAYS on their radar as something that has to be implemented . Eg.: Fees collected, a file kept on permit-holders, blah blah. And then sure as sh*t, one year, years later, when they're doing their annual review of their various "permits", someone is sure to think "Gee, do we really want all these yahoos out there digging in our parks ?". So they yank it altogether. Thus as you can see, it was much better to have been silent on the subject, rather than expressly sanctioned/allowed/permitted.

 

[GKL]

Hey GKL, haven't you seen all the silly rules and distinctions and definitions that come with permits, when dreamed up at various places ? Eg.: the "fine print" ? Things like : "Not within 10 ft. of any tree", or "digger tool shall not exceed 3 inches in length", or "turn in all items to lost & found" (yeah right), or "on sandy beaches only", blah blah blah. And ... seriously now.... do you think that ANYONE is interested in distinguishing, or even thinking about such sillyness ? The question is really: WHY is someone commenting on shovel lengths, trees, earthworms, lost & found, blah blah.

I too find it "interesting". Ie.: why do they care in the first place, to the extent that it's even spelled out on a city-list-of-rules. And I know the reason why.



Even if this bizarre series of events were true, then still: What put it on that "committee's plate" and radar as something that needed addressing IN THE FIRST PLACE ?



I'd venture to guess that there are plenty of md'rs who either 1) got permission (as if it were needed), or 2) had a "permit", in a city that ever dreamed those up. And still got the stink-eye and scram. EVEN if they can "flash their permission" or "flash their permit". Because all that the griper has to do is get on his cell-phone, call down to city hall and say "But he's tearing the place up !" (which isn't true, of course). So "permits" are not some sort of carte-blanche.

And have you noticed that many cities that used to have these "lovely permits that we all feel so good about", will ..... years later .... simply revoke them altogether ? There's been cases of this. And if you wonder "why ?", here's why: Because the MERE FACT that this is on a list of permits, that they issue, means it's PERPETUALLY ALWAYS on their radar as something that has to be implemented . Eg.: Fees collected, a file kept on permit-holders, blah blah. And then sure as sh*t, one year, years later, when they're doing their annual review of their various "permits", someone is sure to think "Gee, do we really want all these yahoos out there digging in our parks ?". So they yank it altogether. Thus as you can see, it was much better to have been silent on the subject, rather than expressly sanctioned/allowed/permitted.

I can understand not being mentioned in the rules at all is best as something that is not mentioned is not prohibited and you can't revoke something that never was "voked" to begin with.

Some detectorists might be surprised what a good impression a well dug and replaced plug can make on someone not educated in the hobby.

Just last year I was detecting and digging in a park area that dates back to the 1700's and was using my long handled Sampson Lesche shovel and an older lady approached close to where I was detecting and digging. Turns out she is a member of the local garden club and came to tend to a small tree that was one of the ones their garden club had donated and planted.

Now you might think UH-OH, maybe she might complain, but I showed her a place where I had replaced a plug and she was amazed at how much it looked like I never dug to begin with, she even went back to her car and got her husband and brought him to where I was and told him, look, it's hard to tell a hole was even dug, and I ended up getting permission to detect one of their properties !

So being willing to show people how using the right shovel and replacing a properly dug plug causes no harm can help educate people to realize they have no real reason for concern.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

I can understand ....

In the case where a "garden club member" (or nosy-nellie park worker, etc...) came and expressed interest or disdain or whatever, then : SURE : By all means let's show them we're doing no harm, blah blah

But as a preemptive move ? To go waiving banners around at "look how good we are" (permission seeking, etc...), when there HASN'T EVEN BEEN AN OBJECTION in the first place ? No.

I too will do my best to avert any disdain by a passerby, by doing exactly as you say. HOWEVER, my objective is to never-let their be any "disdain" IN THE FIRST PLACE. If that means going at lower traffic hours, to avoid such lookie-lous ? Fine. Like nose picking, you sometimes need to be discreet in your timing, so as not to offend the squeamish.

 

[diggin4clad]

I'm anti-shovel unless you're using it in some cornfield or woods on a privately owned site you have permission to hunt. Shovels give off a bad image and camo gear isn't too far behind either.

 

[GKL]

In the case where a "garden club member" (or nosy-nellie park worker, etc...) came and expressed interest or disdain or whatever, then : SURE : By all means let's show them we're doing no harm, blah blah

But as a preemptive move ? To go waiving banners around at "look how good we are" (permission seeking, etc...), when there HASN'T EVEN BEEN AN OBJECTION in the first place ? No.

I too will do my best to avert any disdain by a passerby, by doing exactly as you say. HOWEVER, my objective is to never-let their be any "disdain" IN THE FIRST PLACE. If that means going at lower traffic hours, to avoid such lookie-lous ? Fine. Like nose picking, you sometimes need to be discreet in your timing, so as not to offend the squeamish.

I indeed was simply referring to educating those that did approach you on their own, that lady I mentioned had not expressed any disdain, just seemed curious. Many people have walked by not far from where I was detecting and acted like they could care less what I was doing and they just went about their business not reacting at all.

If someone comes by while I am detecting even if they are not expressing disdain (haven't had any disdain so far ) but just curious, it doesn't take long to show them how unobvious a hole I dug looks when a properly dug plug is replaced, and that's one less person to have a wrong impression of how we leave the area.

 

[GKL]

Please let me clarify I am not saying that everyone in all locations might use a shovel without any negative reactions, we each have to make a judgement call for our particular area because some areas might be highly sensitive while other areas are more laid back and easy going.

I understand some detectorists might live in areas that seem to be very anti-metal-detecting and you feel like you're "walking on eggshells" detecting in apprehension that each time you get down to dig a hole a "negative nellie" is going to report you and cause problems and if you live in such an area I can appreciate your concerns, but some of us live in areas where we have yet to get one complaint or even a negative look and feel like we can simply relax and enjoy the hobby with confidence.

I can appreciate there are exceptions where such concern is warranted and places where detecting has been banned by those who lack an understanding of how harmless the hobby of metal detecting can be. On the other hand we need to realize not all areas are so anti-metal-detecting that they are waiting for the slightest excuse to ban it, the official document I found from Baltimore shows that, so I think each of us need to get a feel for how our individual areas are, some areas might be overly sensitive, other areas are more laid back and reasonable.

Well put above Gary, sometimes ya just gotta use your head and adjust accordingly....

Thanks, like I said I realize some live in areas that might be overly sensitive and I can understand they need feel the need to avoid shovels there and that's fine, I was just saying some areas are more laid back and reasonable about things, like the official document from Baltimore I found online that says shovels are okay as long as they are shovels specifically designed for metal detecting. Everyone has to get a feel for how their area is and decide accordingly based on how sensitive their area might be.

 

[SageGrouse]

I wear a reflective vest when detecting, partly to be safe the times I might get close to where cars might drive by, but also to show I'm not trying to sneak around unseen since I know I am doing nothing wrong, it also has the added benefit of maybe having local people think I am a worker doing something and not give me a second thought, but if asked I would be honest and not say I'm a worker. (So far I have not had any negative looks or remarks about my detecting and using a Sampson Lesche shovel)
View attachment 480401

OK, the vest is a great idea. But it needs something!
If you are good at stenciling, you can cut a stencil and use fabric paint to put the inscription below on the vest. THEN a LOT of folks will leave you SEVERELY alone!

BOMB DETECTION UNIT!
If you see me running, try to keep up!​

Sage(Ahh, sweet solitude!)Grouse

 

[GKL]

Thanks, like I said I realize some live in areas that might be overly sensitive and I can understand they need feel the need to avoid shovels there and that's fine, I was just saying some areas are more laid back and reasonable about things, like the official document from Baltimore I found online that says shovels are okay as long as they are shovels specifically designed for metal detecting. Everyone has to get a feel for how their area is and decide accordingly based on how sensitive their area might be.

Let me add that while I realize I am doing nothing wrong, I still don't try to flaunt that I have a shovel and heave it over my shoulder, ect., but I also do not act timid, I just act natural and casual because I know I am doing nothing wrong.

That same park I mentioned that dates back to the 1700's that I have detected and used my Sampson shovel to dig, on more than one occasion police cars have parked within about 40-50 feet from where I was detecting and digging with my Sampson long handle shovel and not once did any of them say anything to me, and I was close enough they had to see what I was doing, so even they seemed to realize I was not doing anything wrong.

 

[GKL]

OK, the vest is a great idea. But it needs something!
If you are good at stenciling, you can cut a stencil and use fabric paint to put the inscription below on the vest. THEN a LOT of folks will leave you SEVERELY alone!

BOMB DETECTION UNIT!
If you see me running, try to keep up!​

Sage(Ahh, sweet solitude!)Grouse

 

[Jamflicker]

I stopped worrying what people think years ago. Who cares what they think.

 

[Stiffwrists]

I stopped worrying what people think years ago. Who cares what they think.

I agree. (Not that you care )

Maybe the attitudes about metal detecting are different in Utah, but I have no problem carrying a lesche style shovel anywhere I metal detect. My plugs are clean.

 

[chillforlife]

I stopped worrying what people think years ago. Who cares what they think.

I see this attitude from all the folks escaping California to our beautiful state. Wish they would stay there.

If what other people think means that you and I won't be able to detect on public property, then I care.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

... If what other people think means that you and I won't be able to detect on public proprty, then I care.

I suggest that was Jamflicker was joking at, was that no one "thinks" a dog-gone thing about what he is doing, in-the-first-place. Eg.: Urban turfed parks in southern CA. And to whatever degree someone might "think" , it's to the same degree as any other park in the USA. Ie.: CA is no different.

 

[stetam]

I agree. (Not that you care )

Maybe the attitudes about metal detecting are different in Utah, but I have no problem carrying a lesche style shovel anywhere I metal detect. My plugs are clean.

Exactly!

 

[Jamflicker]

I see this attitude from all the folks escaping California to our beautiful state. Wish they would stay there.

If what other people think means that you and I won't be able to detect on public property, then I care.

I know, us Californian are screwing up everything. There isn’t a state more beautiful than California btw. So sorry but we can debate states in another thread.

I suggest that was Jamflicker was joking at, was that no one "thinks" a dog-gone thing about what he is doing, in-the-first-place. Eg.: Urban turfed parks in southern CA. And to whatever degree someone might "think" , it's to the same degree as any other park in the USA. Ie.: CA is no different.

Exactly Tom. Make clean plugs and you don’t have a problems. Take your trash and throw it away. Not breaking any laws so that’s what I meant by not caring and enables me to detecting in peace other than looking over my shoulders in some places.

 

[Jamflicker]

I agree. (Not that you care )

Maybe the attitudes about metal detecting are different in Utah, but I have no problem carrying a lesche style shovel anywhere I metal detect. My plugs are clean.

Haha thanks for seeing the humor in my comment.

 

[jmaryt]

Maybe someone (or some MD club) in that town made a campaign contribution or otherwise lobbied their elected representative to allow MD shovels. Short of the low level bureaucrat in the parks department, most politicians likely don't care one way or the other.

this is true! they don't! and could care less! fine with me! just sayin'

(h.h.!)
j.t.