Dflan83
Elite Member
I have to second this 100 percent while multi IQ is great, there is something verry special about FBS that I just cannot explain. It seems to lock dead on coins and you know 100 percent of the time its there.
I use my CTX exclusively for land/backup water machine
and my equinox for the beach.
give me a machine with multi iq and fbs and take my money
longbow62
Forum Supporter
Guys no offense, but you can't tell me yall can tell a silver dime from a Memorial cent 100% of the time with a CTX or Etrac. My buddy uses both and I call coins within 90%-95% of what he does with my Nox. I even out call him sometimes with the Nox.
The CTX target trace gives you more useful info in certain situations. If you are into discrimination hands down the Etrac and CTX are better for that. I would put both tops for Cherry Picking, but these days as scarce as silver is you can't afford to pass on targets that could be silver. I got bit twice this year on heavily worn low reading silver dimes the same day. That hurt!
Anyway in my dirt I don't see FBS I or FBS II being significantly better than a Nox to warrant their use. In the heavier trash I have always done better than my buddy using his CTX or Etrac. I had an Etrac for a while, and just didn't see the point of keeping it. They are both still outstanding machines, but unless recovery is improved and they are made at least as light as a Equinox is I'd never think of buying one.
The CTX target trace gives you more useful info in certain situations. If you are into discrimination hands down the Etrac and CTX are better for that. I would put both tops for Cherry Picking, but these days as scarce as silver is you can't afford to pass on targets that could be silver. I got bit twice this year on heavily worn low reading silver dimes the same day. That hurt!
Anyway in my dirt I don't see FBS I or FBS II being significantly better than a Nox to warrant their use. In the heavier trash I have always done better than my buddy using his CTX or Etrac. I had an Etrac for a while, and just didn't see the point of keeping it. They are both still outstanding machines, but unless recovery is improved and they are made at least as light as a Equinox is I'd never think of buying one.
Rattlehead
Forum Supporter
No, not 100% of the time. I do get fooled occasionally… Usually by well worn silver. But, a lot of the time, yessir, I can indeed tell a silver dime from a memorial and even a clad dime. Anyone who puts in the time to learn the subtle differences in signal can do the same. You see that’s the thing.. With FBS you don’t get the silver dime reading all over the place like an Equinox. It actually locks on very consistently.
It’s not just the accurate TID. It’s a combination of things that lets you say “hey, THATs an old coin”. The accurate numeric depth readout (not jumpy arrows representing a couple of inches each), the tone pitch which can be expanded to really give a sharp squeal on silver, the 2D FE-CO discrimination which is superior to anything else I’ve tried, and yes Target Trace which helps seal the deal on whether or not you have a coin beneath your coil. The magic of FBS isn’t just one of those things. It’s combining the accurate info provided by ALL of them together which makes the CTX and Etrac such outstanding cherry picking machines. That’s why so many of us still swear by them. I’ve owned a Nox 800, a D1 and now a D2. No way in hell would I still be swinging a 5 lb CTX if it didn’t offer something special that I couldn’t get from those lightweight machines.
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Dflan83
Elite Member
What Rattlehead said. Additionally when reading silver dimes especially 12 - 44 most 90% of the time is a clad dime. If i get a 12 - 45 this is always a good sign that there is silver in the ground. Combined with the depth of the coin I can usually tell if its old.
12 - 44 can fool you the other 10% of the time if there is a copper (wheatie) but I will take what I can get.
12 - 44 can fool you the other 10% of the time if there is a copper (wheatie) but I will take what I can get.
longbow62
Forum Supporter
I don't know how many of you read or post on the Dankowski forum, but there is a thread where he asked Equinox owners a question it evolved into a rather long 18 page topic. Some critical pages about the next gen. Equinox start at about page 11 or 12. It was over a year ago and said he was testing the prototype Flagship detector. Seems like he always called it the next generation Equinox, and Multi-IQ was at the heart of it.
The topic is also worth a read on the whole FBS vs. Multi-IQ debate.
The topic is also worth a read on the whole FBS vs. Multi-IQ debate.
Rattlehead
Forum Supporter
There’s no debate for me. I’ve used both extensively so I already know from first hand experience which works best for me and the type of hunting I do. I don’t doubt they’ll make the next flagship another Multi-IQ machine. They’re bean counters and will likely go with whatever is easiest/cheapest to manufacture that they can turn a big profit on. I’m no engineer but I’d be willing to bet that it takes a lot more $$$$ to manufacture something with the feature set of a CTX vs something like an Equinox. Plus, the latest trend seems to be geared toward fast SMF machines selling at lower prices. They’ll make their money from mass sales rather than unique features like Target Trace, GPS and 2D disc. So with that in mind, I’d say it’s highly unlikely that the new flagship will be a FBS based detector. Oh well, I can always hope.
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longbow62
Forum Supporter
Again pure speculation on my part, but we are even of opposite thinking even on what the flagship detector from Minelab's feature set will be. It will probably have a color screen with target trace. At least FE-CO I.D. or maybe something even better. There is no reason a fast and deep machine can't have exactly the same features as the CTX.
What sense would it make to put out a slightly improved Equinox? I mean it's a great detector in my opinion, but totally lacks premium features. I seriously doubt it won't have some new or seriously upgraded features similar or better than the CTX. Remember it's supposed to be a flagship detector.
Rattlehead
Forum Supporter
I doubt it’s possible, but wouldn’t it be awesome if they could somehow combine the two? A lightweight FBS machine with all the bells and whistles, plus a turbo button that switches to Multi-IQ for hunting in thick iron or trash. I don’t even care what the price tag says. I’d have to get one regardless.
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cellrdwellr
Elite Member
IMO, replace is the wrong term. Regardless of what minelab produces next, the CTX has already cemented itself as arguably one of the best silver sniffers out there, and it cannot be replaced. I would imagine they will continue to sell, and be sold. How many used CTX machines do you see around? Not many, that's because people are keeping them, and for a reason. Wish I held onto mine for sure. I'm patiently awaiting the next release, I will use this years silver/gold proceeds to fund the next release, but I have some saved already. My guess is, going by previous releases, it will not be cheap. 1-3k range would probably be realistic. Just my take on the situation.
GreenMeanie
Elite Member
- Joined
- Jun 6, 2006
- Messages
- 525
I would still own a ctx if it was lighter and had more recovery speeds.
Otherwise it is still a great machine.
Otherwise it is still a great machine.
Dflan83
Elite Member
Sorry late response here, but why couldn't they be combined? After all they run on software anyway and all you would need to do would be create a few different modes of operation. The Tx and Rx coils are the same unless I am missing something.
The only issue I can see is the power requirements between the two modes. If FBS takes that much more power to run then maybe it could not be done but if its all software anyway its just generating different frequencies and selecting the appropriate algorithm for the response.
GreenMeanie
Elite Member
- Joined
- Jun 6, 2006
- Messages
- 525
I would say the deus II is in between a CTX and nox.
Deus II has the best modulation of the newer detectors I have used so far,great depth and ID at depth. They gave me the waterproof detector I wanted too along with much more.
But I would say the tones of the CTX and screen with that info to look at was great. They need to add more recovery speeds to the CTX that would of helped keep it in the running against the speed machines but maybe they couldn't do that with FBS.
Right now it would be hard for me buy a improved CTX with the high price TAG when I have a deus II . A new CTX would have to be a killer machine to get me to leave the deus II and I loved my CTX.
Deus II has the best modulation of the newer detectors I have used so far,great depth and ID at depth. They gave me the waterproof detector I wanted too along with much more.
But I would say the tones of the CTX and screen with that info to look at was great. They need to add more recovery speeds to the CTX that would of helped keep it in the running against the speed machines but maybe they couldn't do that with FBS.
Right now it would be hard for me buy a improved CTX with the high price TAG when I have a deus II . A new CTX would have to be a killer machine to get me to leave the deus II and I loved my CTX.
Rattlehead
Forum Supporter
From what I've heard, the reason they haven't moved forward with a lighter FBS detector is what you mentioned. The power requirements. As for combining something like FBS and Multi-IQ into one machine, I have no idea what all would be involved to make that happen. So just wishful thinking on my part.
I agree with that 100%. That's exactly where I'd put the D2.
Dflan83
Elite Member
ah well that is a ashame. I have an eqinuox and while multi iq is great, I guess FBS just really fits my style of hunting and most of the time I can tell what is underneath the coil.
That's not to say that the multi iq algorithm cannot be improved, because it definitely can but when you start adding more filters and discrim.. well you need to process those signals accordingly which slowed down FBS but made it king on indication and depth.
The eqinox was so popular multi iq in a new flagship is a guaranteed. Minelab will have to win over some of the FBS crowd though if its on there exclusively.
Maybe I am old now but with my CTX and eqinox, I feel like I have the best of the both worlds and really have no desire to spend money on a new machine. While the Deus II is interesting, I don't think it does a ton that my current machines do not do.
Minelab I am sure are watching the market waiting for the right time for a release and I'm sure it will be a hit. I think for me though, I always wait a year after a machine is released to see how it does and to give time for customer reports to come in.
Sorry for the rambling..
That's not to say that the multi iq algorithm cannot be improved, because it definitely can but when you start adding more filters and discrim.. well you need to process those signals accordingly which slowed down FBS but made it king on indication and depth.
The eqinox was so popular multi iq in a new flagship is a guaranteed. Minelab will have to win over some of the FBS crowd though if its on there exclusively.
Maybe I am old now but with my CTX and eqinox, I feel like I have the best of the both worlds and really have no desire to spend money on a new machine. While the Deus II is interesting, I don't think it does a ton that my current machines do not do.
Minelab I am sure are watching the market waiting for the right time for a release and I'm sure it will be a hit. I think for me though, I always wait a year after a machine is released to see how it does and to give time for customer reports to come in.
Sorry for the rambling..
atomicbrh
Elite Member
ah well that is a ashame. I have an eqinuox and while multi iq is great, I guess FBS just really fits my style of hunting and most of the time I can tell what is underneath the coil.
That's not to say that the multi iq algorithm cannot be improved, because it definitely can but when you start adding more filters and discrim.. well you need to process those signals accordingly which slowed down FBS but made it king on indication and depth.
The eqinox was so popular multi iq in a new flagship is a guaranteed. Minelab will have to win over some of the FBS crowd though if its on there exclusively.
Maybe I am old now but with my CTX and eqinox, I feel like I have the best of the both worlds and really have no desire to spend money on a new machine. While the Deus II is interesting, I don't think it does a ton that my current machines do not do.
Minelab I am sure are watching the market waiting for the right time for a release and I'm sure it will be a hit. I think for me though, I always wait a year after a machine is released to see how it does and to give time for customer reports to come in.
Sorry for the rambling..
I think you are correct about the timing of a new Minelab release.
Even if Minelab has a warehouse full of a fully tested, refined new flagship detector, why introduce it to the market now and have that announcement diluted by two other new detectors? It is better to wait and bring it out later when it will receive more attention.
Laxsaltman
Elite Member
There's no mistaking a silver dime with a Memorial with my ETrac.
cellrdwellr
Elite Member
Agreed, we have enough drama in the metal detecting world currently, another minelab flagship would likely change everything. The back and forth going on right now would be WAY worse. Waiting also gives them a glimpse at what they are up against. They know we want it, but timing is critical too. I wouldnt be surprised to hear something from minelab within the next year or so, but that's just speculation on my part. It would be nice if they could incorporate a competitive pinpointer somewhere along the line too. The pro finds were ok, not great IMO.
Well,
I actually had this happen in the wild. Located a memorial Penny signal in older site with Etrac. Dug down and out popped a nickel,,then next out came a merc dime.
And if one places a nickel on top of a dime and checks with Etrac. What does one get? Memorial penny ID /aluminum twist cap ID.
cellrdwellr
Elite Member
Sounds about right, wonder what would happen if you put the silver on TOP of the nickel, same results? I cant tell you how many good finds I have made in the memorial/aluminum screw cap range. Big gold included.
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