• Forum server maintanace Friday night.(around 7PM Centeral time)
    Website will be off line for a short while.

    You may need to log out, log back in after we're back online.

Would you detect or ask for permission first?

Robert JK

New Member
Joined
Jun 20, 2022
Messages
18
There is an old late 1800's house that is city owned. The caveat is that there is a no trespassing sign in the window of the vacant house. Would you think this would apply to entering the structure, or stepping onto the property as a whole?

The house is on a highly visible road, so it's likely I will be noticed if I jump on the property.

Thanks,
 
Put it this way, if you ask the city for permission, the answer will be no.
 
Also, if someone else happens to call the cops and you don't have permission, just be polite and show the cop that you have no ill intent, and aren't damaging anything. The worst that would typically happen, is you'll be asked to leave.

Trespass laws are heavily based in "intent". Meaning, the repercussions for trespass are dependent on why you trespassed in the first place. In other words, trespass to break and enter is very different than trespass to metal detect. Trespass to metal detect would probably result in laughter, not punishment.
 
I'd rather do the right thing and get a "no" than to do the wrong thing because I felt I could, when I couldn't.

It might be a bit nit picky, but I kind of feel that if there was a sign in the yard or on a tree, everything would be off limits, but a sign in a window might mean just stay out of the house.

I guess that's why I'm asking this in the first place. To see what people think and how they might handle this situation.
 
I'd rather do the right thing and get a "no" than to do the wrong thing because I felt I could, when I couldn't. ....

I don't understand this answer. Why is the "right thing" to do, to ask "Can I ?". When that's not necessarily a prerequisite, in the first place ? Ie.: That's only begging the question at-hand-here Ie.: Isn't that the very thing we are discussing ? Who said you "couldn't", in the first place ? :?:

For things like this, and for innocuous benign parks, the problem with asking desk-jockies "Can I ?", is that you can often run into the "No one cared UNTIL you asked" psychology. :roll: And then sure, you might fetch a "no". But does that mean anyone would have cared or given 2 sh#ts ? Probably not (until your "pressing question").

There was rows and rows of military housing and barracks slated to be torn down, at an Army base near me. And like the O.P. Describes : Signs on the buildings said "No trespassing". We helped ourselves to the lawns, no problem. One time though : A security guard M.P. guy started to raise a fuss, pointing to the signs. We merely assured him that we were out front (by the sidewalks) and not in the buildings. Thus obeying the signage. He just shrugged his shoulders, and drove off. We continued hunting.
 
I don't understand this answer. Why is the "right thing" to do, to ask "Can I ?". When that's not necessarily a prerequisite, in the first place ? Ie.: That's only begging the question at-hand-here Ie.: Isn't that the very thing we are discussing ? Who said you "couldn't", in the first place ? :?:

For things like this, and for innocuous benign parks, the problem with asking desk-jockies "Can I ?", is that you can often run into the "No one cared UNTIL you asked" psychology. :roll: And then sure, you might fetch a "no". But does that mean anyone would have cared or given 2 sh#ts ? Probably not (until your "pressing question").

There was rows and rows of military housing and barracks slated to be torn down, at an Army base near me. And like the O.P. Describes : Signs on the buildings said "No trespassing". We helped ourselves to the lawns, no problem. One time though : A security guard M.P. guy started to raise a fuss, pointing to the signs. We merely assured him that we were out front (by the sidewalks) and not in the buildings. Thus obeying the signage. He just shrugged his shoulders, and drove off. We continued hunting.

I guess the question is more so...what does a no trespassing sign actually mean and does it change depending on the lcoation of where it's posted?
 
I guess the question is more so...what does a no trespassing sign actually mean and does it change depending on the lcoation of where it's posted?

I'm sure the laws vary state by state. To me, a NT sign on the bldg means NT w.r.t the building, but I am a known simpleton and literal constructionalist.

Ironically, when I run into these sites on main roads, they seem to be pretty much hunted out anyway. Maybe that is a tell, maybe not. YMMV.
 
I hit abandoned houses all the time owned and maintained by the borough. Meaning they cut the grass, houses are junk. I don't ask, and no one says anything
 
.... and no one says anything

"No one says anything" ? Then at first blush, it sounds like no one cares . And it sounds like a non-issue. Eh ? But no. On the contrary: It merely means you didn't go ask enough people "Can I ?". Shame on you ! :cool3:
 
There is an old late 1800's house that is city owned. The caveat is that there is a no trespassing sign in the window of the vacant house. Would you think this would apply to entering the structure, or stepping onto the property as a whole?

The house is on a highly visible road, so it's likely I will be noticed if I jump on the property.

Thanks,

If you did that where i am at, you have a 6x8 room, 3 meals a day and someone to sleep with you! :( :no:
 
There is an old late 1800's house that is city owned. The caveat is that there is a no trespassing sign in the window of the vacant house. Would you think this would apply to entering the structure, or stepping onto the property as a whole?

The house is on a highly visible road, so it's likely I will be noticed if I jump on the property.

Thanks,

Communities wind up with odd bits of property for all sorts of reasons and may or may not have any development plans for the property. It may be that the "No Trespassing" sign is a knee jerk thing to keep people out of the structure so they don't get hurt. How big is the city? Is it a small city where you know some of the city fathers/mothers? I'd consider some very low key investigation into what is the situation. Do know someone who is a local who could make a citizen's inquiry since it is public property?
 
I also detect a private school where I got permission and they have no trespassing signs posted everywhere. Despite having been granted permission, I still feel a little weird swinging past one "No Trespassing" sign after another.

I guess I must have a guilty conscious or something! :lol:
 
If you did that where i am at, you have a 6x8 room, 3 meals a day and someone to sleep with you! :( :no:

Aaaahhh, Ok : So do you have any examples of someone who had to "share a jail cell with Bubba", for having metal detected from the front lawn of a city-owned abandoned structure ? Sounds like you do. Since, after all, it's imminent.

Hence, by all means, please give us some links to these arrests & jail. I would very much like to see them. Thanx !
 
Aaaahhh, Ok : So do you have any examples of someone who had to "share a jail cell with Bubba", for having metal detected from the front lawn of a city-owned abandoned structure ? Sounds like you do. Since, after all, it's imminent.

Hence, by all means, please give us some links to these arrests & jail. I would very much like to see them. Thanx !

There are small towns in the USA, where the police will arrest you for whatever they want. I think I know what he's referring to.

As for no trespassing sings, if you did not see them, generally speaking, they can't get you for criminal trespassing, or whatever elevated charge it may be in your state for being notified once about no trespassing.

As my attorney says.... it's more important to know the Judge, than it is to know the law!
 
There are small towns in the USA, where the police will arrest you for whatever they want. I think I know what he's referring to.....

Great ! Then in the context of the current topic/thread/discussion :

You too must have examples of arrests, for someone having metal detected from the front lawn of a (gasp) city-owned abandoned structure. Perfect ! Please share the link(s).

I suspect that any links to "arrests" and "jail cells with bubba" that anyone can find, will be examples of persons who were being obnoxious and couldn't take a scram. Or someone sneaking an obvious off-limits historic sensitive site, etc..... But for something of the caliber of the OP's current discussion ? Please, by all means, let's see links to any such arrest or jail. I'm all ears.
 
Great ! Then in the context of the current topic/thread/discussion :

You too must have examples of arrests, for someone having metal detected from the front lawn of a (gasp) city-owned abandoned structure. Perfect ! Please share the link(s).

I suspect that any links to "arrests" and "jail cells with bubba" that anyone can find, will be examples of persons who were being obnoxious and couldn't take a warning. Or someone sneaking an obvious off-limits historic sensitive site, etc..... But for something of the caliber of the OP's current discussion ? Please, by all means, let's see links to any such arrest or jail. I'm all ears.

You assume because it can be done, someone has been arrested over it.

A lot of these places, you just know what not to do. You don't have to be arrested, you can detained for up to 96 hours, without being charged with anything. Once again.. you may beat the rap, but you won't beat the ride!

Under Section 856.021, Florida Statutes, it is unlawful for any person to “loiter and prowl” in a place, at a time, or in a manner not usual for law-abiding individuals, under circumstances that warrant a justifiable and reasonable alarm or immediate concern for the safety of persons or property in the vicinity.

Cops in Florida use this all the time, to bring in people.

I agree, if you kiss their ass, they are probably not going to take you in. But... many people let their ego get in the way.
 
I'm not sure with a metal detector but trust passing is a big no, no here. The one thing i do know, if you jump a fence to go onto the property they will get you. If there is no fence, you may walk up the drive way without a problem.
 
You assume because it can be done, someone has been arrested over it.

A lot of these places, you just know what not to do. You don't have to be arrested, you can detained for up to 96 hours, without being charged with anything. Once again.. you may beat the rap, but you won't beat the ride!

Under Section 856.021, Florida Statutes, it is unlawful for any person to “loiter and prowl” in a place, at a time, or in a manner not usual for law-abiding individuals, under circumstances that warrant a justifiable and reasonable alarm or immediate concern for the safety of persons or property in the vicinity.

Cops in Florida use this all the time, to bring in people.

I agree, if you kiss their ass, they are probably not going to take you in. But... many people let their ego get in the way.

I agree 100% with you. Now if this was in the 80"s they would not say much other than to leave now.
 
Back
Top Bottom