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  #21  
Old 05-19-2022, 09:38 PM
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My guess is there are probably more detectors hurt by crazy people than snakes.

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  #22  
Old 05-19-2022, 09:39 PM
JohnnyPhoenix JohnnyPhoenix is offline
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Originally Posted by atomicbrh View post
In my state the rattlesnakes are fast but not as fast as the copperheads and cottonmouths. I wonder if the much higher 100 plus degree temperatures here make them faster than their rattlesnake brethren in Wisconsin where the temperatures are lower?
Iíve worked with both timber rattlesnakes and eastern massasaugaís, and the saugaís were far more aggressive, but topping out at just over 24Ē, the have a lot to be worried about. We had some animals with radio transmitters implanted and most didnít survive: the transmitters were recovered under Great-horned Owl nest in owl pellets. The smaller snakes are more high-strung compared adults, even within species. Also, hunting strategy between them is different, with rattlesnakes being a more passive wait and strike vs copperheads/cottonmouths (Agkistrodon) being more active hunters. Sure, the warmer temperatures allow southern snakes to have a much larger activity window and more breeding success, but I think strike speed is more an environmental artifact than climate related. Even snake have upper temperature levels that they can tolerate, and become more nocturnal when things get too warm.
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  #23  
Old 05-20-2022, 08:07 AM
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Originally Posted by JohnnyPhoenix View post
Iíve worked with both timber rattlesnakes and eastern massasaugaís, and the saugaís were far more aggressive, but topping out at just over 24Ē, the have a lot to be worried about. We had some animals with radio transmitters implanted and most didnít survive: the transmitters were recovered under Great-horned Owl nest in owl pellets. The smaller snakes are more high-strung compared adults, even within species. Also, hunting strategy between them is different, with rattlesnakes being a more passive wait and strike vs copperheads/cottonmouths (Agkistrodon) being more active hunters. Sure, the warmer temperatures allow southern snakes to have a much larger activity window and more breeding success, but I think strike speed is more an environmental artifact than climate related. Even snake have upper temperature levels that they can tolerate, and become more nocturnal when things get too warm.
Our state's snake biologist for the department of wildlife and fisheries always said that snakes irregardless of species travel in exactly the same path from the time hibernation is over until hibernation begins again. In other words if the snake is under picnic table #10 at Wildwood state park at 10 AM on July 4, it will be there on July 4 every year at 10 AM. I do not think this is true. I think going after prey with their fantastic sense of smell and interaction with humans/animals makes this pattern of movement impossible. What do you think?
Also, a few years ago I had a huge mud snake known commonly as a black runner here sniff me out from over 40 yards away. It raised up the upper third of its body in the air and rotated around to keep me upwind to know where I was. Like you said some of them are exceptional at avoiding predators.
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  #24  
Old 05-20-2022, 09:26 AM
JohnnyPhoenix JohnnyPhoenix is offline
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Originally Posted by atomicbrh View post
Our state's snake biologist for the department of wildlife and fisheries always said that snakes irregardless of species travel in exactly the same path from the time hibernation is over until hibernation begins again. In other words if the snake is under picnic table #10 at Wildwood state park at 10 AM on July 4, it will be there on July 4 every year at 10 AM. I do not think this is true. I think going after prey with their fantastic sense of smell and interaction with humans/animals makes this pattern of movement impossible. What do you think?
Also, a few years ago I had a huge mud snake known commonly as a black runner here sniff me out from over 40 yards away. It raised up the upper third of its body in the air and rotated around to keep me upwind to know where I was. Like you said some of them are exceptional at avoiding predators.
It is somewhat true that snakes travel their same territories but not with clockwork precision. We followed a number of Timber Rattlesnakes with radio transmitters implanted and clear year-over-year patterns developed. The larger (older) snakes had the longest paths traveling well over a mile from the den location, smaller ones tended to go to a spot and hang out within a 100 yard or so of that spot, with gravid females having the most restrictive range, heading to a known "nursery" rock and spending the entire summer there until the young were born in early September. There were some variations with weather: during a particularly dry period, they all tended to move closer to a water source, but overall tended to stay on track. We named them things like "The Swamp Fox" for his wetland preference, and another "The Road Warrior" because he always hung out at a roadside hill that was cut in to make the highway.

It was also clear they got to know we weren't going to kill or eat them, as they didn't often rattle when we approached them, they would just sit quietly or retreat into cover while we took notes. We only handled them at the bookends of the season for weight and growth data, so they didn't get too used to us. It's always a challenge to study wildlife with significantly changing its behavior.
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  #25  
Old 05-20-2022, 10:59 PM
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I dont think Ive seen a rattler that big before. I almost stepped on one about 10 years ago, but it was early in the morning and cold so it was still lethargic. We have the prairie rattlers, sometimes called the western timber rattler, and they are somewhat docile. Havent seen one in awhile since I saw one crossing the road in central WY about 3 years ago. I like when I see/hear them first.

Down in AZ is where the mohaves dwell, and they can be very aggressive. We've been snowbirding for awhile, but I have yet to see one. Id like to get some snake gaiters soon, but Im not sure that they would protect me from that monster in the pic.

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  #26  
Old 05-20-2022, 11:42 PM
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Originally Posted by TommyJay View post
I dont think Ive seen a rattler that big before. I almost stepped on one about 10 years ago, but it was early in the morning and cold so it was still lethargic. We have the prairie rattlers, sometimes called the western timber rattler, and they are somewhat docile. Havent seen one in awhile since I saw one crossing the road in central WY about 3 years ago. I like when I see/hear them first.

Down in AZ is where the mohaves dwell, and they can be very aggressive. We've been snowbirding for awhile, but I have yet to see one. Id like to get some snake gaiters soon, but Im not sure that they would protect me from that monster in the pic.
Big snake in the pic but the stick is near as long as the snake making it appear much larger!
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  #27  
Old 05-21-2022, 05:42 AM
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I am glad venomous snakes are one thing I do not have to worry about here in the UK. Having spent a little time in the bush in RSA when I was younger, I saw enough to last me a life time...

I have to say though, if I lived with my family in a rural area,I would have zero tolerance of venomous snakes on my property or near by, especially if I had young children. Sorry if that offends the bunny huggers, but that's just the way it would be and that would be regardless of any local wildlife laws...

Out in the Sticks, I would very much be about avoidance and precautions, but back home, family would come first, regardless of how small the risk is perceived to be...
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  #28  
Old 05-21-2022, 09:21 AM
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This has been a good, informative thread.
If you detect long enough you will have interaction with snakes.
It is an outdoor activity.
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  #29  
Old 05-21-2022, 11:17 AM
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Definitely learned a few things reading the replies. Cant say I've seen anything like that around here. Seen a few big black snakes in the rivers over the years, but we mostly see garter and the occasional milk snake, all generally a foot or less in length. I think snapping turtles are probably more of a hazard around here. I've had some big snappers come up and try to eat the trout off my stringer before. Seen quite a few while kayaking as well. Big boulder sized snappers, could probably take a limb off with ease!

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  #30  
Old 05-21-2022, 12:34 PM
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They say the baby rattlesnakes are more dangerous than the big ones. Rumor is they can't control their venom output when biting?

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  #31  
Old 05-21-2022, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Pete e View post
I am glad venomous snakes are one thing I do not have to worry about here in the UK. Having spent a little time in the bush in RSA when I was younger, I saw enough to last me a life time...

I have to say though, if I lived with my family in a rural area,I would have zero tolerance of venomous snakes on my property or near by, especially if I had young children. Sorry if that offends the bunny huggers, but that's just the way it would be and that would be regardless of any local wildlife laws...

Out in the Sticks, I would very much be about avoidance and precautions, but back home, family would come first, regardless of how small the risk is perceived to be...
King snakes and those big black snakes are our friends if you have one on or near your property you should feel good. click on the link to see the video.

https://www.facebook.com/walterbjaco...38358008399309

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  #32  
Old 05-21-2022, 01:35 PM
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not many dangerous snakes around here. the timber rattler is supposed to be around but rare; i've never seen one. the copperheads are uncommon and I've seen plenty out near ragged mountian (well known climbing spot) and they have always been "non aggresive". even once climbed up to one, face first. it just sat there all sunning itself while I cleaned out my shorts.

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  #33  
Old 05-21-2022, 01:54 PM
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Originally Posted by TrenchKnife View post
not many dangerous snakes around here. the timber rattler is supposed to be around but rare; i've never seen one. the copperheads are uncommon and I've seen plenty out near ragged mountian (well known climbing spot) and they have always been "non aggresive". even once climbed up to one, face first. it just sat there all sunning itself while I cleaned out my shorts.

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  #34  
Old 05-21-2022, 06:24 PM
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Originally Posted by metaladdict View post
They say the baby rattlesnakes are more dangerous than the big ones. Rumor is they can't control their venom output when biting?
That, plus their venom is more toxic compared to a mature snake; that is, it has more concentrated toxins. Also, they are way more likely to strike because they are a small fry. Adults are rather secure and know all they have to do is rattle and most predator's will leave them alone. I've seen some of the most impressive threat and strike displays from Dekay's Snakes, barely larger than a pencil. A lot of animals have an inherent respect for rattlesnakes (Don't Tread on Me) and many species will mimic rattlesnake behavior. They will coil up, flatten their head to look triangular, shake their tail, etc. Unfortunately for them, the unwitting human observer falls for the ruse and dispatches the snake. When confronted with the correct ID, there's often some denial "Oh no, I'm positive it wasn't a Milk Snake."

I guess the perspective I try to keep is whenever I enter the field, I'm a guest in their home, so I try to be mindful of that.
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  #35  
Old 05-21-2022, 11:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Pete e View post
I am glad venomous snakes are one thing I do not have to worry about here in the UK. Having spent a little time in the bush in RSA when I was younger, I saw enough to last me a life time...

I have to say though, if I lived with my family in a rural area,I would have zero tolerance of venomous snakes on my property or near by, especially if I had young children. Sorry if that offends the bunny huggers, but that's just the way it would be and that would be regardless of any local wildlife laws...

Out in the Sticks, I would very much be about avoidance and precautions, but back home, family would come first, regardless of how small the risk is perceived to be...
Thank you Pete.
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  #36  
Old 05-22-2022, 03:26 AM
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snakes on my property or near by, especially if I had young children. Sorry if that offends the bunny huggers, but that's just the way it would be and that would be regardless of any local wildlife laws
So you'd break the law by killing any animal that scared you? Pathetic.

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  #37  
Old 05-22-2022, 03:35 AM
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Thank you Pete.
Thank you, Pete, for what? Telling everyone he'd break the law if an animal scared him and may "endanger" his rugrats? You and Pete are the reason why so many people despise hunters and trappers. You think hunting and trapping laws don't apply to you on your land or when no one's looking. Pathetic.

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  #38  
Old 05-22-2022, 08:34 AM
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Originally Posted by FreeBirdTim View post
Thank you, Pete, for what? Telling everyone he'd break the law if an animal scared him and may "endanger" his rugrats? You and Pete are the reason why so many people despise hunters and trappers. You think hunting and trapping laws don't apply to you on your land or when no one's looking. Pathetic.
Read it again freebird. He never mentioned the word animal. He was talking about venomous snakes around his house. You are the anti hunter and trapper on any forum you belong to.
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  #39  
Old 05-22-2022, 10:10 AM
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Originally Posted by FreeBirdTim View post
So you'd break the law by killing any animal that scared you? Pathetic.
Snakes don't scare me in particular, but I do have a good appreciation the danger many of the venomous varieties pose..

I had a very good friend who was bitten by puff adder on a farm he worked on in RSA. The bite was bad enough, but he had a terrible reaction to the anti venom as well..He was in intensive care for a couple of weeks when the situation was touch and go...he was unable to work for several months afterwards and was told if he was ever bitten again, he could not receive anti venom because of his reaction.

So yeah if I had a property in snake country, any dangerously venomous snakes would not be tolerated.

We have a mildly venomous snake over here and they are a different story...I have seen several over the years, including almost sitting on one, but I am happy to watch them from a distance, and let them go on their way...

If you put the life of a snake over that of your family, that's down to you..
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  #40  
Old 05-22-2022, 04:42 PM
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YES, freebird, I would break the law to prevent a poisonous snake from biting one of my
children. Jus to be clear....

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