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Old 07-01-2020, 08:39 AM
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Chipk Chipk is offline
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Default Insurance demands

As info: I am pursuing permission to hunt a property and the Board of Trustees demanded proof of insurance and a release of liability letter.

Several years ago I had discussed the possibility of an insurance policy to cover my detecting activities with my agent. He had advised against it as a waste of money.

He told me that as long as this is a hobby and I remain as an unpaid nonprofessional, then my HOMEOWNERS policy would cover any and all damages and liabilities I might cause. He cited as an example that a friend of his took another person water skiing and accidentally put the motor in reverse and severely injured the friend. His Homeowners covered the medical bills, compensation, etc.

So I called my agent and he sent me a letter stating this along with the portion of my personal policy stating it and I then sent this to the Board along with a statement absolving them of any liabilities towards me.

I was unaware of this coverage and wanted to share it in case anybody else is faced with this hurdle.

Now waiting for a final ok.

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  #2  
Old 07-01-2020, 08:52 AM
DbblTap DbblTap is offline
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Glad you got something in writing.

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  #3  
Old 07-01-2020, 09:44 AM
GTS225 GTS225 is offline
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Maybe I've got too much conspiracy theorist running around upstairs, but it sounds suspicious to me.
Once they know there's insurance coverage, what's to stop them from filing a claim for sod damage after you detect? It may get them a new lawn, with no out-of-pocket for them.
Then again, maybe this is their way of trying to tell you no.
I'm not so certain I wouldn't move on.

Roger
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Old 07-01-2020, 10:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Chipk View post
As info: I am pursuing permission to hunt a property and the Board of Trustees demanded proof of insurance and a release of liability letter.

Several years ago I had discussed the possibility of an insurance policy to cover my detecting activities with my agent. He had advised against it as a waste of money.........
This is my impression. I was reviewing my coverage with my agent and brought up this topic out of curiosity. He basically said I'd want to max out my homeowner's insurance before there would be any reason to get an umbrella liability policy. He said this would be his advice even if I was operating for a small amount of compensation, such as finder's fees for rings.

It sounds like the kind of place that might have volunteers for clean up projects, landscaping, painting, teach classes, etc... I seriously doubt they check the insurance policies of those people, and they're just as likely (if not more) to break something, slip and fall, steal, etc... Assuming you're planning to give them any relics that are directly related to that property, you're a volunteer, too.

I've had homeowners ask that I email them a simple statement indicating I'm taking full responsibility for my actions while on their property. Having detected lots of places with zero incidents, that's a risk I'm willing to take, if such a statement would even matter in court anyway.

When I've heard this concern I have a list of properties ready to list that I've detected and are similar and had no liability concerns and I had no incidents.

I think we'll all be interested to hear how they react to your letter.

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  #5  
Old 07-01-2020, 10:34 AM
KOB KOB is offline
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This sounds like a policy Tom would be happy to have.
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  #6  
Old 07-01-2020, 01:02 PM
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Chip i know you can get bonded for a fee. a friend did security work and made good money, and was bonded to protect himself. but, he was making money not looking for it...

and i do know working around lawyers if there is nothing to get why sue? of course you have a house and assets so its a risk.

sounds like a plan Chip.

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Old 07-03-2020, 01:05 AM
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Originally Posted by KOB View post
This sounds like a policy Tom would be happy to have.
haha, I luv ya KoB -bro !


I am of the opinion that most anytimes you hear the "song and dance" of "insurance liability" (for when it comes to permission issues on our hobby) , that it has NOTHING TO DO WITH INSURANCE ISSUES on our hobby. It is, as GTS 225 says : Nothing more than a convenient way to say "no".

I have experienced this first hand before, when someone brings this "liability" issue up, I gleefully tell them that I (as a company owner) have $1 million hanging over my head, and can have a cert.-of-ins. in their hand in 5 minutes with a few phone calls. But guess what ? Their answer is STILL "no". Meaning that wasn't what they were ever concerned about. See ?

And as for "filing a claim for sod damage", oh ppuullleeaasse : Does anyone here have ANY links to any lawsuits involving "sod damage by an md'r that was resolved with insurance" ? Oh C'mon, the cr*p that some people worry about boggles my mind.

And I would also add that if someone ever DID get their own personal insurance to "cover md'ing activities", and then gleefully show that to potential property owners, is probably the FASTEST way to get a "no". All that will do is conjur up legal hassles.

So if someone says "no", then let's face it: That means "no". This whole enterprise is more a case of 1) "No one cared till you asked", and 2) Reconsider the way/methods you are using to "ask", in the first place.
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Old 07-04-2020, 10:45 AM
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Tom you are right, i agree.

you are in legal field i think, so you know the art of persuasion is an absolute art. It has been employed by con artists since the beginning of time. even Biblical as i believe.

being a retired police officer/ detective, i took a class called Verbal Judo. it was a week long. and it works well and seems to be forgotten somewhat today, but dealing with unreasonable opinionated people in todays time is slightly more difficult. still, it can work.

the art is to convince the person that you are there to help, you understand, sympathize, are trying your best, and you are listening, and convince them to agree with you.

the VERY FIRST THING IN CLASS WAS DO NOT LET YOUR SPOUSE READ THIS BOOK. PERIOD. we had some married police couples... that was real interesting. some donnybrook arguments.. dont you try that on me! the reason only one should read it...lol...

it basically was the art of persuasion. with calmness. diffuse and bring them over to your side. you could convince someone to agree with just about anything, even if some concessions on both sides. defuse it make them think the way you want to or less aggressive. ....

unfortunately the great orators and silver tongued devils over the last several hundred years gave speeches that lead to events that were not pleasant.,...again the power of persuasion. piped pipers using this technique to a degree.

i believe with verbal judo training on how to get into someones head a little the right way would open doors.

my issue is the hysterical society locally has put word out to not let anyone detect your yard! we are looters! they keep a watchful eye and have harassed me a couple times.i used it on one in a park, looking at his barefoot kid and produced several broken bottlenecks with aluminum caps, nails glass shards, and a hypodermic needle from the swings chip lot. i carry plastic tubes with stoppers i get from emergency inhalers to put them in to dispose of them and protect children. nasty stuff.i drop them in Sheriffs office no questions asked drug disposal bin after i text a law enforcement friend i have found one and have it contained, with picture, by phone, time a date stamped. so if stopped by other law they wont gig me. it s a little trouble but works and is responsible. i asked do you want this for your kid or anyone else? i am trained in this type stuff having worked on drug units. in the end, he was actually in charge of renovations of the park and gave me a hesitant but ok pass as long as no damage and cleaning up. he had full authority to toss me. it worked

the book is called Verbal Judo and has been updated. i do not own a copy anymore for obvious reasons. i remembered the first thing taught!

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Last edited by dixiedigger57; 07-04-2020 at 11:02 AM.
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  #9  
Old 07-04-2020, 11:50 AM
kweis kweis is offline
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Originally Posted by dixiedigger57 View post
Tom you are right, i agree.

you are in legal field i think, so you know the art of persuasion is an absolute art. It has been employed by con artists since the beginning of time. even Biblical as i believe.

being a retired police officer/ detective, i took a class called Verbal Judo. it was a week long. and it works well and seems to be forgotten somewhat today, but dealing with unreasonable opinionated people in todays time is slightly more difficult. still, it can work.

the art is to convince the person that you are there to help, you understand, sympathize, are trying your best, and you are listening, and convince them to agree with you.

the VERY FIRST THING IN CLASS WAS DO NOT LET YOUR SPOUSE READ THIS BOOK. PERIOD. we had some married police couples... that was real interesting. some donnybrook arguments.. dont you try that on me! the reason only one should read it...lol...

it basically was the art of persuasion. with calmness. diffuse and bring them over to your side. you could convince someone to agree with just about anything, even if some concessions on both sides. defuse it make them think the way you want to or less aggressive. ....

unfortunately the great orators and silver tongued devils over the last several hundred years gave speeches that lead to events that were not pleasant.,...again the power of persuasion. piped pipers using this technique to a degree.

i believe with verbal judo training on how to get into someones head a little the right way would open doors.

my issue is the hysterical society locally has put word out to not let anyone detect your yard! we are looters! they keep a watchful eye and have harassed me a couple times.i used it on one in a park, looking at his barefoot kid and produced several broken bottlenecks with aluminum caps, nails glass shards, and a hypodermic needle from the swings chip lot. i carry plastic tubes with stoppers i get from emergency inhalers to put them in to dispose of them and protect children. nasty stuff.i drop them in Sheriffs office no questions asked drug disposal bin after i text a law enforcement friend i have found one and have it contained, with picture, by phone, time a date stamped. so if stopped by other law they wont gig me. it s a little trouble but works and is responsible. i asked do you want this for your kid or anyone else? i am trained in this type stuff having worked on drug units. in the end, he was actually in charge of renovations of the park and gave me a hesitant but ok pass as long as no damage and cleaning up. he had full authority to toss me. it worked

the book is called Verbal Judo and has been updated. i do not own a copy anymore for obvious reasons. i remembered the first thing taught!
I've had that course as well. I was in State environment law enforcement mostly dealing with private landowners doing stuff without the environmental permits. The course was taylored for that so not really so much would work well for detecting permissions but going into the permission request with confidence is one of the biggist parts for success. I agree that if they are asking for insurance they already have their mind made up to deny your request even if you present them with proof of coverage. I belive having the right personality with first impressions before you even pop the question determines yes or no. Just saying.
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